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Confederate flag rises at I-75 and I-4, and it will rise again

By Andrew Meacham, Times Staff Writer
In print: Sunday, June 15, 2008


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TAMPA — Thirty men stood in a rectangle Saturday near Interstates 75 and 4, each clutching a piece of the Confederate flag. On the back of one man's leather vest, a skull grinned beneath the words: "Southern Discomfort." Below the skull, a patch: "Welcome to the U.S. Now work, pay taxes, and speak English."

At 8 a.m., they hoisted the supersized flag, which weighs about 100 pounds. Dozens cheered and applauded as the flag reached the top of the pole and rippled lazily in the breeze.

The Sons of Confederate Veterans erected the flag on private property, where they are building a $100,000 monument to honor Confederate soldiers. They raised the flag Saturday morning — Flag Day — and took it down in the afternoon. It will soon fly at the site permanently.

Reactions of several African-American onlookers ranged from pragmatic to resigned.

"It's a part of history," said Terrance Jerelds, 28. "You can't move forward until you address the past."

Noah Thomas, 33, said the flag is "just a bit over the top." His ancestors came from North Carolina. He believes they were slaves.

There also was Nelson Winbush, 79, one of a handful of black Sons of Confederate Veterans in Florida. A retired high school assistant principal, Winbush wore a charcoal suit with suspenders and a Confederate flag tie.

"It's a symbol of Southern heritage," Winbush said as the flag ascended the 139-foot pole. "Most people look at it and don't know what the hell they're looking at."

Winbush was 5 when his grandfather, Louis Napoleon Nelson, died in 1934 at age 88. He still remembers some of his grandfather's stories — including one of Union and Confederate soldiers holding clandestine prayer meetings before resuming their battles.

When the shooting started, Winbush said, "He was shooting like everybody else."

Nelson served as a company chaplain and was a bodyguard for E.R. Oldham, a general in the 7th Tennessee Cavalry of the Confederate Army. Oldham's commander, Gen. Nathan Bedford Forrest, earned notoriety after the war as the first Grand Wizard of the Ku Klux Klan.

Joseph Glatthaar, a University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill historian, has doubts about a black man serving as a chaplain fighting alongside soldiers.

"He would have been a body servant — but that's a slave," said Glatthaar, the author of Forged in Battle: the Civil War Alliance of Black Soldiers and White Officers.

Prejudices against slaves bearing arms ran so deep that it took a recommendation by Gen. Robert E. Lee in 1865 to make black soldiers legal.

Black soldiers did fight for the Confederacy, said Elisabeth Laskin, a Harvard University lecturer. But they were few. Lee's recommendation came so late that only two black companies formed in Richmond before the war ended.

While the Union started signing up freed slaves as soldiers in 1862, the South resisted because to enlist blacks would have run counter to deeply held presumptions underlying the war.

"Are we fighting for this land, or are we fighting to preserve a strict hierarchy, which includes these racial inequalities?" Laskin said.

Winbush said he doesn't care what academia may say. "The Yankees run the media," he said.

At the unfurling of the 30-by-50 foot flag, some at the scene wondered what is to come.

"Of course I am concerned about the image this projects for the Super Bowl and the election," said Donald Hallback, 48, who said he is a friend of Marion Lambert's, the leader of the flag project.

Hallback, who is black, said he doesn't think Lambert is a racist. He came to support the Sons of Confederate Veterans' right to celebrate their culture, he said.

"I can't stop them,'' Hallback said as the group raised the flag. "What I fear is that extremists on both sides will use this to inflame people.''

Andrew Meacham can be reached at ameacham@sptimes.com or (813) 661-2431.



[Last modified: Jun 20, 2008 04:21 PM]



Comments on this article
by SuicideRisk Jun 16, 2008 11:20 AM
Out in my front yard is a 20 foot flagpole and on it I fly the flag. It is the flag used by the Ku Klux Klan since 1866, and I hope it offends you. It is the flag that slave ships flew during the slave trade, and I hope it offends you. It is the flag that flew during 220 years of American slavery, and I hope it offends you. It is the flag that flew over the genocide of millions of Native Americans, and I hope it offends you. It is the flag that flew over the entire length of Jim Crow days, and I hope it offends you. It is the flag that flew over segregation camps in WW2, and I hope it offends you. It is the United States Flag that flies out front, and I hope you are offended. None of those things happened under the Confederate Flag, so why are you offended?
by William Jun 16, 2008 11:19 AM
The Confederats were traitors and racists. They should be remembered with disgust, regret, and embarassment.
by Ron Jun 16, 2008 11:19 AM
Like the last sentence says:"What I fear is that extremists on both sides will use this to inflame people." Why do you think the Times ran this article in the first place? To inflame people and to create a story where there isn't one.
by JT Jun 16, 2008 11:18 AM
There are too many mexican flags around. Evidently too many mexicans fanasize about taking back the land that was lost in the mexican-American war where they had their _ _ _ _ _ handed to them. We definately need to forbid foreign flags in the USA!
by Carrie Jun 16, 2008 11:18 AM
No one cares.Stop trying to bring attention to it.Face it, we don't agree it should be there, but flying that flag is not getting the attention they expected so now they are frustrated. Advice to the media...GIVE IT UP.There is more important news...
by Stan Jun 16, 2008 11:18 AM
Where's the Uhuru's at? I'm sure they'll want their own giant flag next.
by willie Jun 16, 2008 11:18 AM
I agree to a point this is extreme, i say lets put the past behind us and also lets abolish the BET, (imagine a only white TV station- oh my god),abolish NAACP too & black only colleges- isn't these organizatons keeping racism alive as well
by Marc J. Randazza Jun 16, 2008 11:17 AM
Freedom means that we have to tolerate speech that we do not like. Anyone who honors this symbol of traitors bigots is an idiot. Nevertheless, I am happy that I live in a country where they can express themselves too.
by Bill Jun 16, 2008 11:17 AM
Another complete zero story. The SPT certainly has a knack for zeros.
by Dave Jun 16, 2008 11:17 AM
You ignorant people need to study history. It is an AMERICAN flag! Nazi's, Japs, NVA, N. Koreans didn't fight that war, Americans did. Slavery was the absolute last reason for the war. It was economic. Slavery was the work force then as you are now.
by Casey Jun 16, 2008 11:17 AM
People have the right to believe in whatever they want and say whatever they want as long as it does not offend other people. Those were the freeedoms their ancestors fought for as well as your own. We are all americans no matter North Or South.
by Dave Jun 16, 2008 11:11 AM
Joe, it's because of Floridians just like you that the SCV is flying this flag--Floridians who show their bigotry against anyone who is proud of his Confederate ancestors who fought bravely for the sovereignty and independence of their States.
by taylor Jun 16, 2008 11:11 AM
i'm truly embarassed for my hometown.
by Dave Jun 16, 2008 11:11 AM
"Go work and pay taxes." Aren't these people against taxes, and even more so, against those immigrants taking the posh strawberry picking and latrine-cleaning jobs?
by Pete Jun 16, 2008 11:07 AM
Once again, if you comment know and understand your history. This whole "if you are not with us your against us" bs has put us and kept us in IRAQ. Worry about our Americans dying today before you shame those who fought for us in the past............
by anthony Jun 16, 2008 11:02 AM
Any black man who celebrates the confedearate flag should have his blackness card repealed. REMEMBER SLAVERY
by wellswood Jun 16, 2008 9:20 AM
Oh, so it's alright for us real Southern people down here to look at all these Mexican, Virgin Island, black power and Puerto Rican flags everywhere, yet you yankee's, that probably don't even know the meaning of the flag have a problem with it.
by Bill Jun 16, 2008 9:19 AM
Another complete zero story. The SPT certainly has a knack for zeros.
by LOUISTHETERRIBLE Jun 16, 2008 9:18 AM
Fly it high and proud like the rest of them do or stop everyone.
by jason Jun 16, 2008 9:18 AM
A symbol of racism, and a war that killed more americans then all of our other wars combined. Those that fly it are traitors to this nation.
by Brandon Jun 16, 2008 9:17 AM
Darryl, I agree with you about the flag, but I also agree with the concept that people here in our country, should be under one flag but also should work, pay taxes and speak English. Seems picking up the dregs of Mexico isn't good for the country.
by Dan Jun 16, 2008 9:16 AM
There were 6 flags over Texas & they embrace their heritage. We as Floridians should also. Only politicians and sensationalist place a negative connotation on the Stars & Bars. It was a fight for independent State Rights just like the Revolution.
by Bob Jun 16, 2008 9:16 AM
Contrary to popular belief, the Confederate flag does not symbolize racism in any way. It is a symbol of freedom from a nation that has stolen what our forefather's fought so hard to acheive...our freedom. We should ban together and take it back.
by Taxman Jun 16, 2008 9:16 AM
These people are exercising their rights under the First Amendment, Daryl. Hope you don't fly a Bucs flag. I fly the US flag proudly. You advocate more laws to restrict more of our freedom. Just because you don't like something, it should be illegal?
by Tammy Jun 16, 2008 9:15 AM
Treason is still treason when you try to overthrow the government of the USA and that is what the Battle Flag means,
by Richard Jun 16, 2008 9:14 AM
Hooray ! as i cling to by Bible and guns
by mike Jun 16, 2008 9:14 AM
Come on Joe and Darryl, give it a break. So what if they want to show what they are PROUD of...Does it really make a difference? Would you prefer it was a gay flag?
by Curt Jun 16, 2008 9:13 AM
I am not offended by the sight of a confederate flag flying. People can say what they want about it. Heritage, racist, hatefull, or what have you. The reality of it is it represents a lost war. Get over it people the south lost.
by Dwight Jun 16, 2008 9:12 AM
Too bad that there are so many people who do not allow a heritage to exist and a history to be remembered. Of course there will be a certain segment of our ignorant society who will want to who will put a racist spin to this.
by Bill Jun 16, 2008 9:11 AM
Freedom of speech.
by Jamal Jun 16, 2008 9:11 AM
I think this newspaper has some kind of sick obsession with the SCV. This story isn't even worth reporting. There are plenty of other newsworthy stories for the Times' to cover, like all the people in the Tampa area losing their homes!
by Ronnie Jun 16, 2008 9:10 AM
Why give people like this all this press? Write a small article if you want and then let them go into obscurity where they belong. The best way to handle these people is to ignore them.
by Jeff Jun 16, 2008 9:10 AM
The media is trying to make this story into an issue. This story has seen more time on the website home page over the last month. Are we trying to get people upset? Are we trying to make this a racial issue? Just let it go, and move on.
by Joe Jun 15, 2008 8:38 AM
Yeah for the toothless masses! Can you guys crawl back into the holes you crawled out of before you embarrass us. Oh wait, too late!
by darryl Jun 15, 2008 8:36 AM
the only flag that should be raised that day is the U.S.flag.this is another reason this country needs to ban all flags that isnt current u.s.flag.you have a bunch of nobodys who fantasize they were in the civil war disrespect the united states.
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