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Times Q&A: Rear Adm. John Kirby talks ISIS, Twitter and his mother's critiques

 
Rear Adm. John Kirby, former Pentagon spokesman, grew up in St. Petersburg.
Rear Adm. John Kirby, former Pentagon spokesman, grew up in St. Petersburg.
Published March 26, 2015

Rear Adm. John Kirby has been called "the most visible face of the Pentagon in years," and his openness and availability as spokesman for the Department of Defense since December 2013 earned him an ovation from the rigid Pentagon press corps when he announced he was stepping down in early March. On the eve of a keynote speech at the New Ideas Conference at St. Petersburg College on Friday, the Times talked to Kirby, 51, a St. Petersburg native, about military messaging, his popular Twitter handle, his mother's critiques of his television performances and his views on the Islamic State group, also known as ISIS or ISIL. The conversation was edited for length.

So, this is home for you.

My dad was a sailor in the Navy. He served on the carrier USS Valley Forge in the mid '50s. He was a machinist mate. He was a mechanic the rest of his life. When we moved to Florida he started working on cars. He bought Barney's Garage in Seminole, and that little car garage helped put me through college at the University of South Florida. My father passed away in 1990. My mom is still alive and well. She lives in the house that we all grew up in, not far from the Tyrone Square Mall.

I read that your mother sends you critiques after press conferences and that she's brutally honest.

Let's just say she's candid about my performance at the podium. She watches them live online and usually within an hour or so, I'd get an email or text from her with a very detailed critique. Certainly if I did not articulate something well enough or clear enough, I got lots of tips on how to do that better.

Can you give us an example?

I did a briefing with my State Department colleague Jennifer Psaki. Jen and I wanted to show that the State Department and Defense Department were really a team, so we decided to brief together, to show that we had a good relationship. That afternoon, I got some tough questions from an (Associated Press) reporter, and I suppose it came across as a rather spirited discussion. And my mother sent me an email afterward saying, You know, you really should try to be more calm, like Jennifer Psaki. She had much more composure at the podium than you did. She is my biggest fan, but what I really appreciate about Mom is she's not afraid to be one of my toughest critics.

You've been called "the most visible face of the Pentagon in years." Why that approach, to be out front like you were?

Secretary (Chuck) Hagel believed that it was really important that the American people have as much understanding as possible about what the Defense Department is up to and how we're spending tax dollars. He encouraged me to do as much explaining as needed. I took that to heart. We approached the issues of the day with an idea to be aggressively transparent.

You broke news on Twitter (@PentagonPresSec). You announced the first American airstrikes in Iraq, for which you took some heat from the Pentagon press corps. What did you learn from that experience, from being engaged in a transparent way on social media?

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You have to think about the information environment as a very dynamic, ever-changing atmosphere and no one method of communicating is ever going to be sufficient. The other thing is, it's very interactive, what I call a "post-audience world." People don't want to be communicated to, they want to be communicated with.

Did you ever get trolled?

What?

Trolled on Twitter? Cyber bullied?

I never heard that phrase before. Any spokesperson in today's environment is going to face critics and a level of vituperative comments on social media, but part of this job is having a thick skin. You can't take things personally.

You said in a speech at the Naval War College a few years ago, "People don't just want access to information anymore. They want access to conversation. They want to be heard." Does that run counter to military culture?

The point I was trying to make was that we have actually proven really good at it overseas. One of the things we've learned in 13 years of war is how to understand other cultures. We've learned foreign languages like Pashto and Arabic, and our leaders have sat cross-legged in tribal shuras. We've gotten very good at trying to look at somebody else's perspective. We should take that great lesson and apply it to other realms of public communication, particularly here at home. Listening is the most important part of communicating. I don't think it's anathema to the military culture.

What did you learn about the media as Pentagon press secretary for a year?

The last 15 months has been a reinforcement of how vital it is that we have a free press and a career field for men and women to challenge the status quo, to be on the scene and provide objective reporting about some of the most important issues facing our country.

You received an ovation from the Pentagon press corps when you announced that you were stepping down. How did that make you feel?

It was incredibly humbling.

What's your forecast for ISIS? What does that outfit look like in a year?

What I can tell you is that the military campaign against ISIL is having success. This is an organization that is no longer on the offense. This is a group that has lost a significant amount of territory since August, more than 25 percent of the territory it had. And territory matters to a group that wants to consider itself a caliphate. This is a group that behaves and acts much differently than it did in the summer, when they swept through Iraq. They don't have the freedom to maneuver or communicate the way they did. This is a group that is very much under pressure.

This isn't just about military tools. What's going to win in the end is when the ideology loses. The ideology is corrupt and will lose, but that's going to take time and pressure.

I read your 13 rules to live by. No. 6 is to always be right. "We can't afford to pass bad information . . . ever." Were there times in your career when you've been asked to pass bad information?

I can honestly say I've never been told to deceive or obfuscate. There have been times when, because I didn't have all the information necessary, I'd have to go back and correct what I've said. The important thing is, if you do it, immediately correct it. And be transparent while correcting it.

Do you do anything special when you're back home in St. Petersburg?

I love Ted Peters. The smoked mullet. I also love the Hurricane. I remember when the Hurricane was just a small shack. It's a great place. Still serves terrific grouper sandwiches. You can't get a better grouper sandwich anywhere.

What do you plan to talk about at the New Ideas Conference?

What I wanted to do is to give them my view of how the best decisions get made and how they get communicated. If decisions are made well, they're easier to communicate.