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By
Jennifer Liberto, Times Staff Writer
In print: Friday, March 21, 2008
Jon Wilson, 36, pulls up his pants as he helps an elderly blind neighbor (who did not wish to be identified) accross the street and to her south St. Petersburg home Thursday, March 20, 2008. Recently the NAACP and Gov. Charlie Crist have come out against proposed baggy pants legislation. “To each his own,” says Wilson, “The problems we have are way bigger than baggy pants.”
TAMPA — Blake High senior Sam Crumbly and junior Owen Kirlew both wore low-hanging dark blue jeans to school Thursday, as they do most days.
Their zippers were almost knee-level, but long T-shirts covered their underwear.
"I don't know why it matters," Crumbly said. "But I'd pull up my pants if someone told me to."
Two hundred fifty miles away, a bunch of lawmakers think it matters a lot.
They've been debating a bill that would force public schools to suspend students like Crumbly and Kirlew who wear their pants too low. The issue has been among the most-talked-about topics in a Legislature otherwise dominated by budget woes.
Now the measure appears doomed.
While the bill, SB 302, passed the Senate 28-11 last week, Gov. Charlie Crist said Thursday he opposes it. The governor's thumbs down came following a meeting with the president of the Florida NAACP, which also opposes the measure.
"I remember when I went to high school, people were worried about how long somebody's hair was," Crist said. "It really doesn't matter. What's important is what you learn, not what you wear."
When asked if he'd veto the measure, Crist said: "Let's see if it gets that far."
Its passage is unlikely, since a similar House bill got watered down. Under the Senate proposal, students would first get a verbal warning, then could be suspended for a second violation of showing their underwear.
The bill has created unusual alliances.
Members of the Senate Democratic Black Caucus support the measure alongside many probusiness Republicans, saying that it will help make youths more employable.
Opposing the measure are libertarian-leaning Republicans who tend to be more hands off when it comes to social issues, like Gov. Charlie Crist, along with Democrats who don't think the Legislature should micromanage schools.
NAACP Florida state president Adora obi Nweze said her group strongly opposes to the measure. It already is waging a campaign to highlight how schools' zero tolerance policies result in a disproportionate number of expulsions, suspensions and arrests of African-American and Latino students. It says this measure would only add to those problems.
"We're trying to keep students in school, not help keep them out," said Nweze, who plans to hold a press conference with the American Civil Liberties Union on Friday.
Bill sponsor Sen. Gary Siplin, D-Orlando, said the "pull-up-your-pants" bill isn't about race, because it targets all students. He argues that schools are supposed to educate students for life, and they need to give kids the tools they need for employment.
"Our obligation is to teach our kids. We teach them how to read, write, how to drive, how to type," said Siplin, a trim lawmaker who always wears pressed, tailored suits at the Capitol, even in summer. "We should also teach them how to dress, because that's a very integral part of getting an interview for a job."
Neither of the Blake students had heard of the bill banning droopy pants, and both said they thought it sounded ridiculous.
"Some days, I just forget to wear a belt," Kirlew said, who "houses" his jeans (wears them extremely low) on no-belt days. "But I usually like to wear them not too big, not too tight."
At the Skatepark in Tampa, several teens gathered after school, though few wore pants loose enough to expose their underwear. It's just not as cool as it used to be, Freedom High sophomore Brandon Baker said.
"I used to wear baggy pants, and no one ever said anything," said Baker who had heard of the bill in his America Government class. "People should be able to wear what they want to wear."
>>FAST FACTS
How they voted
Senators who voted against the Democrat-sponsored bill:
Democrats: Nan Rich of Weston, Charlie Justice of St. Petersburg, Ted Deutch of Boca Raton, Arthenia Joyner of Tampa
Republicans: Don Gaetz of Niceville, Dennis Jones of St. Petersburg, Victor Crist of Tampa, Charlie Dean of Inverness, Paula Dockery of Lakeland, Steve Oelrich of Gainesville and Alex Villalobos of Miami.
[Last modified: Mar 24, 2008 01:16 PM]
Comments on this article
by Louie
Mar 24, 2008 1:16 PM
Good to see our tax dollar are going to waste by lawmakers who want to double as the fashion police. who cares how people where their clothes? i think it's stupid and gross, so guess what i turn the other way easy as that
by pamela
Mar 24, 2008 1:15 PM
I feel this is another genaration they should be able to wear their pants the way they want to i dont see no problem with it to be honest in im in my early 40's this is the year 2008 only older guys wear their pants above their waist
by Carolyn
Mar 24, 2008 1:13 PM
I'm for having young men and women to pulling up their pants for it does not bring and small amount of respect towards them because our socety does not accept this sloppy appearence in the best way of trusting or respecting them in spite of thei
by Ann
Mar 24, 2008 1:13 PM
they should not be suppended but warned with some other forms of measures to show why not to wear them in a sloppy manner
by Mia
Mar 24, 2008 11:40 AM
Applause to you, Governor! You don't find these lawmakers finding the low cut, cleavage revealing tank tops and hip hugger jeans the young ladies wear to be offensive. Hmmmm...
by sher
Mar 23, 2008 6:07 PM
I'm a teacher. It's the extremely low pants with thin, TIGHT briefs that is offensive, especially when the wearer is walking past a seated person. It's intentional, not 'ooh, I forgot my belt'. School uniforms is about the
by john
Mar 23, 2008 6:07 PM
I just don't understand why would you want to be associated to a prisoner. This "style" comes from a one size fits all philosophy like prison orange jumpsuits. Besides GIRLS do you really like the "look"?
by healthy
Mar 23, 2008 6:06 PM
why should i be subjected to seeing your nasty underwear... i thought this was a health issue... can females walk around with their panties showing like that... what if these guys have crabs etc... i think it is more a health issue than anything
by gopblonde
Mar 23, 2008 6:06 PM
Why do the students have to be suspended? Why can't the schools have appropriate sized pants with ugly suspenders for them to wear? I am sure the Salvation Army's and Goodwill's would be happy to donate pants. Try that idea on for s
by tampaguy69
Mar 23, 2008 12:15 PM
Hey Edward, never thought of that but it sounds tempting.
by neil
Mar 23, 2008 12:15 PM
If our legislators don't have more important things to worry about they haven't been paying attention. This sounds like an issue tailor made for ronda storms (little r, little s).
by Mike
Mar 21, 2008 8:20 PM
We should all take pictures and publish them. In fifteen years bell bottoms, mutton chops, leisure suits, parachute pants and Flock of Seagull haircuts will pale compared to this absurd...whatever it is.
by Vic
Mar 21, 2008 8:19 PM
BTW:baggy pants are one thing;not too bad really:it is the pants that are so low the buts are CUPPED beneath the waist band..THAT is the DISGUSTING look most are complaining about.There is NO self respect in THAT look!There is NO NEED for that l
by Rome
Mar 21, 2008 3:34 PM
What's funny to me is that people that make remarks like Harry are the same type people that oppose what Obama's pastor said and call him racist. The pot calling the kettle black... Wake up... They're just pants.
by Ron
Mar 21, 2008 3:33 PM
For those opposed to the bill, instead of attacking the legislators trying to do something, attack the local school boards that aren't doing anything. Help them to take responsibility instead of passing the buck.
by Saddened
Mar 21, 2008 3:33 PM
I know many baggy pants wearing African American teens that have dedicated their lives to non-violence, education, and community service.
Harry these fine young men are far from stupid.
by Brooke
Mar 21, 2008 3:31 PM
Harry, my daughter has improved her reading scores by taking a class that uses good sound rap to teach vocabulary. While I don't listen to rap, I won't call it degenerate as it has enabled my daughter to possibly pass the FCAT.
by JoeF
Mar 21, 2008 3:06 PM
Even your momma doesn't want to see your nasty drawers. This subject just gives more reason to require school uniforms. Shape up or get out of school. We still need garbage collectors and McD's bun turners. Show us all just how stupid you a
by Harry
Mar 21, 2008 1:22 PM
Baggy pants are a sure sign of stupidity. Why is it no surprise that the same folks that gave us degenerate rap music would produce this excellent fashion trend?
by Debbie
Mar 21, 2008 1:21 PM
Control of this belongs first with parents. And since they CLEARLY aren't doing their part, this should be MANDATED as dress code policy BY THE SCHOOLS. Not the legislature. It can be enforced and work. It's been done in other states with s
by Sandra
Mar 21, 2008 1:18 PM
I think it reflects on everyone that pants are wone so low you see their underwear.It refelects back to the prison culture.You tell someone to pull up their pants and they get hostile with you.Go figure.
by Bev
Mar 21, 2008 12:11 PM
I have strong objections to this bill on the grounds that it infringes on local control. Local school boards are fully capabale of developing and enforcing dress code policies without the interferance of the Legislature.
by nancy
Mar 21, 2008 11:10 AM
With all the teachers being arrested for sexual misconduct with students, I think energy and resources can be better used than in fighting what is just another fashion trend. Let's look at the character of the person, that how low their pants a
by Dan
Mar 21, 2008 11:10 AM
What people don't seem to realize is, its not just about looking sloppy. It has to with making our schools safer. When someone wears loose fitting clothing, how does anyone know what is under the clothing, such as: drugs, knives or even guns.
by JP
Mar 21, 2008 11:01 AM
Dress for success???
I don't think schools should allow any clothing that is unacceptable by the average employer. Kids have to learn how to make it in the real world. Most companies wouldn't hire anyone dressed like that to take out the t
by Bonnie
Mar 21, 2008 11:00 AM
Personally, I don't want to look at someones filthy underware.It's gross!Also, these kids are prime targets for an attacker or an abduction. How fast can you run with your knees tied? Where has common sense gone?
by Holly
Mar 21, 2008 11:00 AM
Charlie! You can't be all things to all people. It doesn't work!
by AJ
Mar 21, 2008 11:00 AM
Get a life, Crist. With all the real issues facing this state, are State politicians really wasting precious time persecuting teens about low-rider pants? Wake up, guys! Get us some high paying jobs! Solve the insurance crisis. Get a life!
by jan
Mar 21, 2008 11:00 AM
Wasting time. These kids need nurturing, not suspension. Spend time mentoring, not legislating.
by Janice
Mar 21, 2008 11:00 AM
What kind of double standard are we sending ? Girls wear skirts so short and pants so low showing t-backs and skin but boys can't wear low pants showing boxers. Imagine that.We have more pressing issues. Lets "crack" down on dres
by don
Mar 21, 2008 8:37 AM
Crist is already looking at VP or at least re-election.
by Libby
Mar 21, 2008 8:33 AM
I think that suspension is a little harsh, but it can be very distracting to students and teachers. Where I work we make them pull thier pants up.
by Edward
Mar 21, 2008 8:32 AM
These kids of today don't realize where the of baggy pants came from. They came straight from the prison system, they wear them low for easy access to the booty. My friend is a guard at a prison and he see's it all the time. Now that's
by mark
Mar 21, 2008 8:32 AM
If people over 18 want to look ridiculous, so be it. For those under 18, parents should be supervising what their kids wear. However, I think our Legislature should focus on more pressing issues.
by mark
Mar 21, 2008 8:32 AM
Hey Charlie how about meeting with the board of education. You are a true politician, and trust me I don't mean that as a compliment. God Bless Fla because were going to need it.
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